[Gintonpar]

I am personally not very knowledgeable on the subject, but do the Colombian leftist insurrectionists retain any credibility? Either ideologically or regarding popular support. Or have they degenerated entirely in to drug runners and bandits?

[Slayer of Cliffracers]

I reckon Chavez may be intending to back them.

[Abood]

I reckon you source your claims.

[Slayer of Cliffracers]

I reckon you source your claims.

I remember reading in VenezualaAnalysis, that Chavez was building up a weapons stockpile of small arms, which was out of line with the needs of the Venezualan army. It was then speculated that this was beacause Chavez was intending to use the arms to support foreign insurrections, the most obvious bieng FARC.

I mean, intervention in Columbia, would create a nice new ally and prevent the USA from using Columbia as a base for war against Venezuala.

[Abood]

Someone needs to learn the art of debating.

"I remember reading VenezuelaAnalysis" isn't considered sourcing.

Seriously man, no offence, but from my time debating with you, and from some other people's complaints (whose names shall remain unmentioned), I've realized that you hardly ever source your claims. And that makes your arguments baseless and, well, people would never believe anything you say.

[Slayer of Cliffracers]

Someone needs to learn the art of debating.

"I remember reading VenezuelaAnalysis" isn't considered sourcing.

Seriously man, no offence, but from my time debating with you, and from some other people's complaints (whose names shall remain unmentioned), I've realized that you hardly ever source your claims. And that makes your arguments baseless and, well, people would never believe anything you say.

So in order to back up your baseless speculation, you need to get someone elses baseless speculation to back you up?

I don't remember where I get most my stuff from. I don't think like that.

[Abood]

So in order to back up your baseless speculation, you need to get someone elses baseless speculation to back you up?

I don't consider an article baseless speculation. Do you?

[Gintonpar]

Back to the question please rather than a personal spat between you two if you don't mind.

[Abood]

I have nothing personal against Slayer.

Anyway,...

Open Letter To the President of the Bolivarian Republic of Venezuela, Hugo Chavez Frias

Dear President Hugo Chavez Frias,

We write to you as persons who are in solidarity with your anti-imperialist politics and with the important social transformations that your government is developing for the well being of the majority of Venezuelans.

In light of these considerations, we were surprised to learn that the security forces DISIP have been actively involved in the detention of Rodrigo Granda (better known as Ricardo González), member of the international relations team of the Revolutionary Armed Froces of Colombia, FARC. According to what one has been able to establish by reliable sources, Granda was detained in Caracas this past December 13 and taken to DISIP barracks. Hours later he was transported to Colombia in the trunk of a car, where he was “officially” “captured.” No judicial or administrative process was taken into account, in a clear violation of applicable Venezuelan and international laws.

One should recall, President Chavez, that Granda has been received by high state representatives and important political and social organizations throughout the world, as part of his diplomatic activity in the search for a politically negotiated solution to the Colombian conflict.

This arrest and subsequent kidnapping resembles more the form of acting of the Colombian authorities and those developed by the dictatorships of the Southern Cone during the sinister “Plan Condor,” than the policies of the Bolivarian Republic of Venezuela.

This is not the first time this has happened, President Chavez. There are various pieces of information that show the assassination and kidnapping of peasant leaders and of Colombian union leaders, in operations coordinated between Venezuelan authorities and Colombian security forces and/or paramilitary forces.

We believe that such procedures, especially by the DISIP, are a serious attack against the national security of your nation. The DISIP has violated Venezuelan sovereignty by allowing Colombian security forces and their paramilitary groups to act with impunity in Venezuela.

More important even: it puts in doubt the loyalty of high ranking officials of the DISIP and of other state institutions with regard to the political process that you are advancing. President Chavez, you have offered to be neutral with regard to the internal Colombian conflict and to help find paths to peace by way of political negotiation and far removed from what the United States and the Plan Colombia propose.

We respectfully ask you, President Chavez, to establish a special independent investigation for clarifying who is responsible for the kidnapping of Granda and, hopefully, of that of other Colombian social leaders in Venezuelan territory.

We respectfully solicit that you continue taking all measures necessary for cleaning the Venezuelan security forces of all who would help violate the sovereignty of your nation and of those who want to isolate the Bolivarian Revolution from the support of popular and social movements in Colombia and in the rest of the world.

Venezuelanalysis.com

It seems like Chavez being neutral on the issue, because I feel that while he wants to support popular movements throughout Latin America, he wants to have diplomatic relations with the Colombian government.

[Gintonpar]

How about FARC's credibility in worldwide leftist thought? Are they seen as being freedom fighters or bandits?

[Abood]

I have no idea, since I didn't know about them until today. But this article makes it seem like they're genuine leftists.

[Gintonpar]

They are also heavily involved in drug running to fund their activities.

Is this an acceptable means to an end or does it mark them as despicable profit driven banditos?

[Abood]

Well, you need to outline their activities in detail if you want me to formulate an opinion about them.

[I]

They are also heavily involved in drug running to fund their activities.

Helped by the US anti-drug policies and the pressure it placed on the Colombian govt.

See! War on Drugs does work

[Gletkin]

They are also heavily involved in drug running to fund their activities.

Is this an acceptable means to an end or does it mark them as despicable profit driven banditos?

The FARC admits to taxing the drug trade but they deny directly owning or managing any cocaine fields or facilities themselves. They've challenged the US govt. to legalize or at least de-criminalize drugs, which would greatly reduce their street value and render them much less profitable.

I don't think they've abandoned political activity. But they've committed acts of political sectarianism. Ingrid Betancourt, who granted is not as radical as the FARC, is nevertheless a left-of-center politician who has been kept hostage by the FARC for years and according to a recently escaped prisoner, chained like a dog. The FARC have also murdered a CUT-affiliated trade unionist. I have no idea why they'd do this as the CUT is thought to broadly share the politics of the FARC and the Communist Party of Colombia.

But I suppose if capitalist democrats can continue to support the Colombian government despite its underhanded brutality, then socialists can "support" the FARC in the same way. i.e. criticize them when they do something wrong, but still support them in general. Just as the capitalists do with the Colombian government.

"Qualified support" (as opposed to blind, uncritical support) I suppose.

[Gintonpar]

Thanks that's pretty interesting.

How is FARC doing in it's insurrection at the moment? Is there a possible ending in sight?

I know Uribe has cracked down more recently on the paramilitaries of both sides, but is there a sign of a resolution in the conflict?

[jaakko]

From what I know, FARC-EP doesn't qualify as sectarian. They're by far the biggest guerrilla army in the country, yet are in fraternal alliance with also the smaller forces of insurrection, such as the ELN and the even smaller EPL of the PCdeC(ML), and participate in international events with organisations of different revolutionary currents (such as the international seminar on The Problems of the Revolution in Latin America regularly held in Quito).

I don't know about the CUT but the legal "Communist" Party of Colombia is shit and doesn't participate in the insurrection in any way.

I don't think it's of decisive importance whether the FARC-EP funds its activities with drug trade or just taxes it. In either case I won't condemn it.

[Gintonpar]

The point I am attempting to highlight about their use of the lucrative drug trade is that it could turn into a conflict of interest.

For example, even if the end of the revolution (culminating in FARC victory) was approaching, the self interest of more corrupt members of the group could lead to them prolonging the war because of the profit being raked in.

[jaakko]

Personal drug profits are away from funding the war. People with interests in profit have interests detrimental to the war effort. If there are corrupt members in the FARC, the problem is the corruption, not drug trade or the taxation of it. If there are corrupt members in the FARC, they don't become less corrupt if they change business to something legal. The war has to be funded some way, and the danger of corruption exists whatever is the source of funds.

[Slayer of Cliffracers]

Personal drug profits are away from funding the war. People with interests in profit have interests detrimental to the war effort. If there are corrupt members in the FARC, the problem is the corruption, not drug trade or the taxation of it. If there are corrupt members in the FARC, they don't become less corrupt if they change business to something legal. The war has to be funded some way, and the danger of corruption exists whatever is the source of funds.

The whole thing, is kind of the sad reality of things.

They need a means to raise funds, and deny funds to their adversaries. Thus they get into the drug trade.

As a result, they get into contact with some corrupt individuals.

But without the drug trade, they couldn't financially support their efforts and the other side would get the drug profits to finance their efforts.