[starman2003]

enlight is right, we should add every way of the totalitarian thought, even the forms we dislike. If we limit the options here we limit the public and we limit the amount of thoughts, that is no way to manage a forum. Furthermore, I would love to know the profound hate towards star wars, have any of you botherd to watch the 5 avaible episodes and have read upon the subject, if you have than you should know these movies are ideal for a begining totalitarian.

We should stick to what works best or is best suited to the present and future, which leaves out archaic monarchy and theocracy. (Monarchy is, or WAS, not totalitarian or Wholist, by the way; it meant very limited government.) Star Wars, again, is just typical, present system propaganda e.g. "evil empire." Jesse already has made his view clear on this.

[Bricktop]

We should stick to what works best or is best suited to the present and future, which leaves out archaic monarchy and theocracy. (Monarchy is, or WAS, not totalitarian or Wholist, by the way; it meant very limited government.) Star Wars, again, is just typical, present system propaganda e.g. "evil empire." Jesse already has made his view clear on this.

I believe we could at least show the other forms. Monarchy and Theocracy ARE types of society that come under the banner of Dictatorship. They should be included, even if we do not agree with them.

Drummond

[Jesse]

our leader, Jesse to say what goes and what doesnt.

If've been waiting for ages to hear that!

If someone gives me a professionl and mature essay, I'll add it, if not, I'm not going to source Star Wars as a reference.

[starman2003]

We should stick to what works best or is best suited to the present and future, which leaves out archaic monarchy and theocracy. (Monarchy is, or WAS, not totalitarian or Wholist, by the way; it meant very limited government.) Star Wars, again, is just typical, present system propaganda e.g. "evil empire." Jesse already has made his view clear on this.

I believe we could at least show the other forms. Monarchy and Theocracy ARE types of society that come under the banner of Dictatorship. They should be included, even if we do not agree with them.

Drummond

They come under the title of authoritarianism; a distinction is usually made between monarchy and dictatorship, perhaps in part because lingering monarchs are often just figureheads. I'm glad we don't agree with them; they are virtually extinct anyway and we shouldn't dwell on them.

[Bricktop]

They come under the title of authoritarianism

Which I believe should also come under this Forum's interests..

Drummond

[New Era]

If someone gives me a professional and mature essay, I'll add it, if not, I'm not going to source Star Wars as a reference.

Give me some time and I'l try to make a mature and professional essay.

[Jesse]

I consider the gauntlet thrown.

[New Era]

Star Wars, hate it or like it, you have to agree that it is one of the biggest movies production, the effect it had on people is unmatched. However this movie is more than fiction, it is one of the best fiction movies about totalitarian goverments. One could say it's typical evil empire propaganda, but one should not forget the fact that the movies are seen in a rebel perspective, thus the story is quite subjective and shows only the "flaws" of the emperium and the "greatness" of the rebels. I shall begin with episodes 4 - 6 and than I shall talk about the first 3, I am going to explain "evil" acts of the emperium and show the truth about it.

The ship of lord Vader captures the ship of the rebel fugitive leia, they kill all soldiers and torture the fugitive for information. They had to kill every soldier because they did not surrender and put the lives on the imperial soldiers in danger, they had to torture the fugitive for she had stolen information that if exposed could lead to the death of many imperial lifes. Thus they did nothing that doesn't happen under the reign of democracy. The second thing where the uncle and aunt of luke skywalker are slain and their farm burned down to the ground, they offerd a home to someone who had dangerous information in his possession and wiping out a place where terrorists live happens now aswell. Thus the emperium doesn't do things that could be seen as evil. In episode 5 the emperium takes possession of a spin city lead by a former criminal to capture the rebels, nothing evil about that. There are many more acts that look like they are evil but are in fact normal things that happen under the reign of democracy aswell.

The fact that the rebels win the struggle against the emperium isn't positive for our views, however the way they win is as unreal as it get, it happens in a fictional universe but even the way how they seem to win seems unreal and thus could not be repeated in real life, that could be called one of the biggest flaws of star wars. However this turn of event is the fault of the creator and time spirit. The death of the emperor is caused by betrayal of his closed servant and more empires have fallen due betrayal. Is the so-called dark side of the force, evil in the movies ? There isn't even proof of anything evil about the dark side in the movies. The jedi are seen as the good, but they seem more as guardians of the out dated theisms of our era and they will fight anything that will lead to progress and knowledge.

The most intresting thing about the star wars movies is how the totalitarian goverment is born, it is born due the demise of the republic, the threats that were growing and the lack of leadership. The senators only argued and palpatine saw it clear that he should take power and create something that would protect them against all those threats. He did, he created a totalitarian goverment stepy by step and that was the key to his succes.

A little piece of work that I created last night but found now the time to post it.

[Bricktop]

You seem to be trying to defend the actions of this fictional 'Empire' by comparing to what it does to what Democracies do today. How does that help exactly?

From my point of view, you are defending the Empire in its military actions and trying to persuade people not of our orientation "we aren't all bad - see, we are like democracies!", not in its political and socio-economic structure, which if anything, is what I want to hear about. (Im not sure about other people)

Keep working at it, I would at least like to see the final piece.

Drummond

[Neo-Manichaean Sarcophobe]

I fail to see how the Galactic Empire can be conceived of as totalitarian. It is more of cross between theocracy and absolutist monarchy. A corrupt, inefficient and relatively powerless empire, where crime syndicates are free to do their business (no real control over outer worlds - Tatooine etc.) and with no particular philosophical foundation...an empire led by an evil sorceror harnessing the "dark side" of the pseudoreligious "force" to fight knightly and noble jedis...the Galactic Empire fits better in Tolkienesque fantasy novels than in science fiction.