[SpecialOlympian]

I love the "Trump is the God-Emperror of Humanity in the year 40K" references because the point of Warhammer 40K is that humanity is losing. It's supposed to be the brutal, death metal end of your species and also the early stuff from the 80's is mocking Margaret Thatcher's government.

[Albert]

All this criticism that Trump has little way of detailed policies. What does Hilary have? What is she proposing exactly?

You people would not have a clue and googling it after you read this does not count.

[Ombrageux]

I love the "Trump is the God-Emperror of Humanity in the year 40K" references because the point of Warhammer 40K is that humanity is losing. It's supposed to be the brutal, death metal end of your species and also the early stuff from the 80's is mocking Margaret Thatcher's government.

Apparently some kind of fascist Ur-Catholic dictatorship is a survival strategy?

[Beren]

All this criticism that Trump has little way of detailed policies. What does Hilary have? What is she proposing exactly?

You people would not have a clue and googling it after you read this does not count.

The Clintons have a history which you don't need to google hopefully. It might be a bit inconvenient to choose between the Clintons and the Trumps, but I'd still prefer another Clinton era to the reign of the Trumps.

[Albert]

Most people who are the loudest in their criticism of Trump are of the same intelligence that they suppose Trump supporters are. They only mock and insultTrump and his supporters. In actual rational discussion these people show how low of intelligence they really have. For all they can do is mock like little children.

[Albert]

The Clintons have a history which you don't need to google hopefully. It might be a bit inconvenient to choose between the Clintons and the Trumps, but I'd still prefer another Clinton era to the reign of the Trumps.

Clinton era? What happened in Clinton era? Same old bullshit. Exactly as I thought, you know of no clear policies or platform. People like you vote for a brand then something concrete.

[Ombrageux]

Albert: I am amazed at how Pavlovian and mob-like the Daily-Show-watching types have become. I think it's just a kind of religious tribalism: they've bought into a bunch of liberal symbols the media have taught them, Trump violates them, and they are anyway taught to hate conservative Americans anyway. I see much hatred in them and little intellectual curiosity.

[Beren]

Most people who are the loudest in their criticism of Trump are of the same intelligence that they suppose Trump supporters are. They only mock and insultTrump and his supporters. In actual rational discussion these people show how low of intelligence they really have. For all they can do is mock like little children.

Sure, the Trump campaign really seems to reach out to intelligent and rational adults.

Clinton era? What happened in Clinton era?

In the Clinton era America had a good time basically.

People like you vote for a brand then something concrete.

People like me are not Trump-supporters. Aside from that I prefer personality to "something concrete" indeed, because "something concrete" doesn't really exist in politics.

[Albert]

Indeed, all you have to do is call out the trigger command by calling someone racist and they will be salivating at their mouth.

@Beren Yes, it was grand old time. Bombing Serbia. Flooding the country with immigrants. Allowing industry to be shipped of over seas. The only really good thing about that administration was a balanced budget.

[Ombrageux]

Beren: Every democratic campaign uses emotion. The problem, if there is one, is the reality-TV "democracy" the U.S. has become. In that system, a reality-TV guy like Trump is apparently the only way to break the stranglehold of the neocons and oligarchs over the American political process.

Trump's broad message - preventing immigration which hurts Americans, defense of American citizens' interests over those of others (Mexicans, Zionists, internationalist oligarchs..) - is certainly something worth engaging with intellectually (though one can certainly disagree).

Out of curiosity: do you support the existence of Israel as a Jewish State?

[Beren]

Trump's broad message - preventing immigration which hurts Americans, defense of American citizens' interests over those of others (Mexicans, Zionists, internationalist oligarchs..) - is certainly something worth engaging with intellectually (though one can certainly disagree).

Sure, Trump and Pence are certainly people worth engaging with intellectually.

[Ombrageux]

Beren, you almost give the impression of systematically responding to others in bad faith. I referred to Trump's message, which I do actually sincerely think reflects that is important intellectually. He simplifies the message for the masses on TV.

[noemon]

In the Clinton era America had a good time basically.

In the Clinton Era, the US destroyed Yugoslavia with the cheers of the leftists and the liberals.

Those were the good times, when people were too rich and stoned to care.

[Beren]

He simplifies the message for the masses on TV.

He doesn't need to simplify it. He simply means to fuck with Mexico, China, Obama's legacy, and immigrants.

Simple as that indeed.

[Albert]

Like Democratic message is filled with intellectual viguor? It is as well mostly catch phrases that mean to relate quickly to general public on visceral level.

Usually it is heart throbbing civil rights era SJW catch phrases of hope and change.

[SpecialOlympian]

Apparently some kind of fascist Ur-Catholic dictatorship is a survival strategy?

In the setting of Warhammer 40K it's more of a "die slower" strategy than a survival strategy.

[SpecialOlympian]

Albert: I am amazed at how Pavlovian and mob-like the Daily-Show-watching types have become. I think it's just a kind of religious tribalism: they've bought into a bunch of liberal symbols the media have taught them, Trump violates them, and they are anyway taught to hate conservative Americans anyway. I see much hatred in them and little intellectual curiosity.

Riff man, riff! Lay that honkey tonk down!

[Ombrageux]

Beren: Well, evidently you are unconvinced and I am disturbed that you said nothing on Israel.

But I will say something for the others, who might be more open minded, on one set of rationales behind Trump's rhetoric:

There is a case for limiting your society's homogeneity.
* Illegal immigrants from Mexico, in particular tend to be of low educational achievement.
* Mexican immigrants have a low low intergenerational educational performance, and on average commit more crimes, pay less in taxes, and consume more welfare than average Americans.
* The President of the United States' first duty is, supposedly to enforce the law of the land, including immigration law.

As Trump said, Mexico "is not sending their best," these are not Indian IT workers or Nigerian PhDs.

I am not saying one needs to agree with Trump but, it seems to me, that there are many perfectly valid arguments for enforcing immigration laws and tightening border security. The American people have a right to decide who is allowed to come into their country and live with them.

SO - You seem less cheerful than before. I always enjoyed your humor.

[noemon]

Beren, you almost give the impression of systematically responding to others in bad faith. I referred to Trump's message, which I do actually sincerely think reflects that is important intellectually. He simplifies the message for the masses on TV.

I think that you have failed to decode most of his messages.

a) He is for carrying forward the Bush Legacy of the War on Terror. That means more Middle-east wars and meddling.
b) He is for taking back the Iran deal, that means putting Iran back into the proverbial enemy situation.
c) He is for demanding that the Europeans help him through NATO to achieve those goals and forcing that situation on Europe.
d) He is for taking away social security from 20 million Americans.
e) His immigration policy, amounts to "we will not accept immigrants from states where there is no state infrastructure" as he said so himself in case someone asks him later "why is immigration not reduced", "well obviously mr speaker because these people are coming here legally from states where there is state infrastructure".

He seems like the typical Neo-Con of the Bush creed and nothing more.

[SpecialOlympian]

I haven't changed, brah. You're the one who has grown distant.

When you use terms like "limiting homogeneity" in earnest internet conversation then it's probably you who has changed, not me. I'm just a simple retarded finance genius trill trillionaire whose state assigned social worker types what I tell her to type. Google teen anal.