Taking sides- Japan is being too quiet! - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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#13449
China and Russia Do not support America's current stance of pre-emption. However Japan did. Is Japan a rising threat to China? And if so will Russia get involved, because they too are aginst the Amirican stance on pre-emption.
By the SovieT
#13618
Its funny you said that, because i heard one guy other day (dont remember where) adn he was giving a clear message to countrys like JApan and other first world countrys, either they join America´s litle game and get some oil and stuff, or they directly attack demonstrating once more the true capitalist imperialism and warmongerism...

its the only way they will survive otehrways America will controll almost all the current viable and valuable resources in the world.-..
By Putinist
#13664
Its funny you said that, because i heard one guy other day (dont remember where) adn he was giving a clear message to countrys like JApan and other first world countrys, either they join America´s litle game and get some oil and stuff, or they directly attack demonstrating once more the true capitalist imperialism and warmongerism...


"Warmongerism"?:?:
By the SovieT
#13718
yup and yet once more my pseudo-english amazes everybody :D :lol:


and once more i must apologize for my bad ass english...
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By FCP
#13845
Interesting that you mention that:

Japan reveals military might

By BRIAN VICTORIA
From Thursday's Globe and Mail

Within weeks, Japan's parlia­ment is expected to give swift passage to three bills that will effectively alter the pacifist constitution that has guided the island nation since the end of the Second World War. The moves are alarming China and North Korea. And they are serving notice that Japan is thinking once more of de­claring its military strength — already far bigger than most people realize.

At the end of the Second World War, the victorious Allies, led by the United States, determined that like Germany, Japan would never again be allowed to become a military threat. Article 9 of the postwar Japanese constitution stated, "The Japanese people forever renounce war as a sovereign right of the nation. . . Land, sea, and air forces, as well as other war potential, will never be maintained."

Despite having been imposed by the United States, Japan's postwar "Peace Constitution" resonated deeply with most Japanese people, who by the time of their nation's defeat in August, 1945, had been at war, mostly in China, since 1931, resulting in nearly three million military and civilian casualties.

However, little more than a year after the new constitution took effect, the United States began to systematically dismantle the constitution's "no war" provisions, which it had initially insisted on. This reversal came with the advent of the Cold War, as the United States real­ized that Japan's strategic location made it critical to the battle against commun­ism throughout Asia. The growing strength of the Japanese left also threat­ened the long-term viability of U.S. bases in that country.

The first step in Japan's rearmament began with a secret National Security Council decision in 1948 authorizing the creation of a 150,000-man "national po­lice force," whose duties included pro­tecting U.S. bases in Japan and U.S. military dependants. With the outbreak of the Korean War in 1950, a 75,000-member National Police Reserve was added. It was the first step toward what the United States hoped would be­come a force of 300,000, commanded by former Imperial Japanese officers and ready to deploy to Korea if needed.

The Japanese government initially re­jected both the larger force and its deployment to Korea. However, after the San Francisco Peace Treaty of 1951, it agreed to enter into a military alliance with the United States, allowing U.S. bases to remain in Japan indefinitely. As well, it pledged to "increasingly assume responsibility for its own defence against direct and indirect aggression" — violating the spirit, if not the letter, of Article 9 of its constitution.

From then until now, there has been a concerted effort, fostered by both the Japanese and U.S. governments, to re­store Japan to the status of a modern military power, albeit one firmly under U.S. military control and tied to its stra­tegic objectives.

By 1973, Japan's armed forces, euphe­mistically designated as "self-defence forces" (jieitai), had already become the seventh strongest in the world. Yet, with­out nuclear weapons of its own, Japan remained ultimately dependent on the U.S. nuclear umbrella.

Today, Japan has 240,000 men and women under arms. Having spent nearly $50-billion (U.S.) a year on defence for each of the past five years, Japan has a force, at least in terms of funding, second only to the U.S. (Russia can no longer af­ford a modern military). Yet Japan does all this while preserving a constitution that states: "The right of belligerency of the state will not be recognized."

To ascribe Japan's steady military buildup solely to U.S. pressure would be wrong; there have always been Japanese political leaders who loathed what they saw as the emasculating provisions of the peace constitution. However, despite re­peated attempts, they have as yet failed to persuade a majority of Japanese voters to eliminate Article 9 through constitu­tional revision. Frustrated, they instead effectively nullified its provisions through the employment of euphe­misms, subterfuges and incremental changes.

Not surprisingly, Japan's ruling con­servative party recognizes that without nuclear weapons, Japan will remain de­pendent on the United States. In a highly controversial statement, Yasuo Fukuda, chief cabinet secretary in Prime Minister Junichiro Koizumi's government, ex­pressed dissatisfaction with this state of affairs on May 31, 2002: "Inasmuch as we have now reached the stage of discussing constitutional revision, it may well be that, depending on changes in the inter­national situation, the people of Japan will decide that we ought to have nuclear weapons. . . . I think there is nothing written in the constitution or in legal the­ory that states we cannot possess such weapons."

Even Japan's main opposition leaders now share those sentiments. In April, 2002, Liberal Party leader Ichiro Ozawa claimed that Japan could easily produce "thousands of nuclear warheads" in re­sponse to China's growing military might. "If China gets too inflated," he noted, "the Japanese people will get hys­terical. It would be easy for us to produce nuclear warheads — we have plutonium. If we get serious, we will never be beaten in terms of military power."

As Mr. Ozawa's remarks suggest, it is China's military and economic power that in the long-term is fuelling the de­bate on Japan's possible acquisition of nuclear weapons. Thanks to the exigencies of the Cold War, Japan has never fully admitted, let alone atoned for, the atrocities committed by its troops in China during the Second World War. Jap­anese government officials have consis­tently denied such barbarities as the 1937 Rape of Nanking or the use of biological weapons to kill as many as 250,000 civil­ians and 12,000 PoWs.

Although China is perceived as posing a long-term threat, the more immediate danger comes from a nuclear-armed North Korea. It was this threat that only last month led the Japanese parliament's lower house to pass three "war contin­gency bills." They allow the Prime Minis­ter to put the nation on a war footing even when there is no more than "fear that such an attack may occur." As de­fence agency chief Shigeru Ishiba made clear during the parliamentary debate on these bills, this includes the possibility that Japan may launch a "pre-emptive strike" against any nation thought to be preparing to attack.

Japan's military currently lacks offen­sive weapons, such as nuclear-capable Tomahawk cruise missiles. But it has begun to explore acquiring them. In the short-term, Japan will no doubt remain a firm ally of the United States and an active member of "coalitions of the will­ing." However, should Japan ever choose the nuclear option in confrontations with China, the West may rue the day Japan was pressured to rearm.

Brian Victoria is senior lecturer at the Centre for Asian Studies at the University of Adelaide, Australia.
By Proctor
#13930
That's okay SovieT, your English is actually pretty good. And I certainly don't have a problem with making up a word or two to express yourself better, I do it all the time.

I don't think Japan is a threat to anyone. Ever since World War II, they have kind of isolated themselves from the world and developed their industry, making them the third (I think) greatest economic power. They're not a military threat to anyone, although they keep their armed forces up to date just to make sure noone trys to mess with them.

As for their lack of nuclear weapons, I think it is simply because they don't want them. Japan lead the world in nuclear technology, they could produce such weapons within weeks. If they are so warmongering, why haven't they?

Another good reason they aren't going to mess with Russia or China is because they don't particularly like getting nuked... :hmm:
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By Yeddi
#13942
yes, i'd agree Proctor, they're the only country that can say first hand that being nuked is a terrible and evil thing.
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By FCP
#14032
I don't think Japan is a threat to anyone.


To "us", perhaps not, but given the historical context they are certainly perceived as such by the Chinese and Koreans -- especially if their scaling up military expenditures.
#14065
To "us", perhaps not, but given the historical context they are certainly perceived as such by the Chinese and Koreans -- especially if their scaling up military expenditures.


Would that be the (North) Koreans or the Japs?
By Proctor
#14242
I don't think China and Korea have too much to worry about. In fact, Japan and South Korea are on very good terms. North Korea is being a dick out of spite.

Sure, they have a bit of history, but look at France and Germany. At each other's throats for centruries, and now closest allies.
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By FCP
#14341
Except that Japan has refused to apologize for, or even acknowledge for that matter, atrocities comitted during the Second World War -- Germany has. This is a severe bone of contention for both the Koreans and Chinese as they feel they have been dishonored. Look at what happened when Koizumi visited that war shrine. Moreover we have a clash of ideologies involved as well, Germany and France are both very much democratic and capitalist societies.
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By joe
#19213
I dont think Japan could ever be a threat to the now
VERY LARGE - VERY LARGE Chinese Army...

Russia is just POV ( poor )
By TTT_Comrader
#20497
As a Chinese myself, I very much hate the Japanese for what they have done in the past, but the thing that really bothers me, is the way they act afterward. They didn't only just deny what happened and refuse to apologize, they had also rewrite their history book, the kids are now learning how the Japanese warriors liberated the Asian nations from Western Imperialists, and also treating those war criminals as god...

Oh well, we can't just blame the Japanese for this, see, the reasons they didn't do what the Germans did, is not because they are not as good as German or anything, it is because of China and USA. See, Japan could very well become another communist nation after WWII, in order to prevent that, as well as tighten her control over Japan, USA had placed those Class "B" war criminals firmly into the seats of the government.

But China had something to do with this, too, thou.

As most of you should know, before, after, and even during the Japanese invasion, there was a civil war in China between the Communists and Nationalists. See, the Nationalists are the founder and the leader of
Republic of China, while the Communists are only consider rebells during the time, the only nation that recognize them is USSR. Anyway, the Nationalists, in order to gain favor and support from the US and Japan, they had given up the right to ask Japan pay/apologize for the war crimes, so that they can turn around and destroy the Reds.

After the civil war is over, when it is the Reds's turn to rule, they, once again, regarding the situation, given up the right to make Japan pay, instead, they had offically refuse to deal with the war crime business with Japan, and guess what, immediately after this, Japan had lend PRC a large sum of money, wow.

But no matter how the government respond to these shit, the people will never allow this to forget. Story written by ink cannot overwrite the history that is written by blood.

As for the Korean situation, see, I'm right here, I'm at the De-Militarized Zone, and look, man, if North and South really goes at it, the first nuke sent by North would most likely hit Japan, since if Japan joins the war, the North would gain the most out of it.
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By Zealot of Rebellion
#24049
Russia, China, and Japan hve enough problems. Though Japan is raising a military for self defense it is more concerned with North Korea. Which is ready to fight, stay at a stalemate, or accept a good treaty. Japan has a public unwilling to fight if it is placed in a situation where a war with China is the option chosen by the government; they highly value their 9th amendment. A war could only happen a long time from now when people support military action and the amendment is either forgotten or repealed.
By The Cactuarian Emperor
#24052
japan vs. China

No contest China would win
By FascistDictator
#24055
Japan has always been a threat to China, and if something took place between the two nations no i dont think Russia would jump in its not there usual way of dealing with things.,
By Comrade Juanito
#24056
JAPAN VS CHINA!! HA! China would win hands down! i mean thats not even fair.
By Comrade Juanito
#24064
Lucky when they attack blindly when noones looking, do you call that luck? or do you call that cowardess?

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