[Genghis Khan]

Obama has created a liberal (massive) government and wants liberal control of health care.

And he indoctrinates kids to be socialists, and he indoctrinates the public to believe in global warming, and he's soft on terrorism, and he has surrounded himself with marxists and communists, and he's trying to take away U.S sovereignty, and he hates white people, and he's planning to take away all guns to melt them down so he can create a giant statue of Mohammad, and he's about to rename the country to "The united socialists of Allah".

See? Now I said it for you. No reason for you to post anything else.

[DanDaMan]

And he indoctrinates kids to be socialists, and he indoctrinates the public to believe in global warming, and he's soft on terrorism, and he has surrounded himself with marxists and communists, and he's trying to take away U.S sovereignty, and he hates white people, and he's planning to take away all guns to melt them down so he can create a giant statue of Mohammad, and he's about to rename the country to "The united socialists of Allah".

Don,t be absurd, no one has ever said he wants a statue!

[Krivich]

Of course they do.
Obama has created a liberal (massive) government and wants liberal control of health care.

But you fail to understand defined words and believe political dogma. So I am wasting my time with you.
Buy a dictionary then come back to this forum.

I'm sorry but we see different when we look to same thing. I know that liberalism is a ideology of minority and for minority. But liberal and massive is equivalent for you.

[DanDaMan]

I know that liberalism is a ideology of minority and for minority.

And this is implemented HOW?

I'll tell you... by implementing massive government health care for the sake of the minority.

That means Liberal is BIGGER. Period.

[Krivich]

I'll tell you... by implementing massive government health care for the sake of the minority.

I don't understant but I think...

[Krivich]

No. In fact, there's a nice, simple book called "Naked Economics". Very simple read, you should pick it up.

Now I don't have the book in my library. Could you say in two words what you mean please? What can I see therein contradicting my words?

[Kapanda]

I can't use two words to explain it, that's why.

But the book elaborates in particular on why capitalism doesn't necessarily demand that certain jobs get badly compensated, and neither does it demand that some have more skills than others. It doesn't have to be that way, it just happens to be that way.

[Prosthetic Conscience]

But liberalisation involves reducing the government's role in the economy

Liberal and reduction are two words that are, fundamentally ,the opposite of each other.
Liberals take more and more control of the economy.
This is why Obama now runs the banks, car companies and owns half the mortgages in the USA.
Bush is also a liberal government man. He paved the way for Obama.

These measures have nothing to do with liberalism.

Of course they do.
Obama has created a liberal (massive) government and wants liberal control of health care.

But you fail to understand defined words and believe political dogma. So I am wasting my time with you.
Buy a dictionary then come back to this forum.

No, DDM, it's you who needs to look at a dictionary. Here, let me get that for you:

liberalization

The action or process of liberalizing; the fact of being liberalized or becoming liberal; spec., the removal by a government of restrictions placed upon the import of goods, the movement of capital, etc.
------------------------
liberalize, v.

1. a. trans. To render liberal; to imbue with liberal ideas or principles; to make liberal-minded; to free from narrowness; to enlarge the intellectual range of. Also (nonce-use) to liberalize away, to do away with by such means.
b. To make Liberal in politics.
c. To incline to liberality. nonce-use.
d. To remove restrictions on (the import of goods, outflow of capital, etc.).
2. intr. To favour liberal opinions; be or become liberal in one's ideas or principles.

Your problem, DDM, is that you have been indoctrinated by right wingers in the US so that you think anything they tell you to dislike is 'liberal'. Maybe you should keep out of conversations about systems and opinions that you don't understand.

[SecretSquirrel]

The true "essence" of liberalism is to be found in the writings of classical liberals such as Locke, Bastiat, J.S. Mill, and other thinkers who advocated against state/government intrusion into the economy and into decisionmaking by private citizens.

In modern times the term "liberal" has generally been co-opted by socialists and statists who go against the true meaning by clamoring for ever more government control over the economy and the private lives of citizens.

The actual "modern" liberal must go by the term "libertarian" or "minanarchist" because modern liberalism is not actually liberalism.

[DanDaMan]

Your problem, DDM, is that you have been indoctrinated by right wingers in the US so that you think anything they tell you to dislike is 'liberal'.

What a joke!
I'm the one indoctrinated... but yet liberal drug use and sex are somehow different in meaning when compared to liberal government!

You are the indoctrinated... not I!

You political zealots are fools.

[JohnRawls]

You political zealots are fools.

Trust me , if you will ever understand how stupendous this sounds coming from you , you will probably die laughing at yourself.

[DanDaMan]

Quote:
You political zealots are fools

Trust me , if you will ever understand how stupendous this sounds coming from you , you will probably die laughing at yourself.

I laugh my ass off at the ability to turn the tables on secular modern Liberals!
What I am doing it taking an atheists argument (science is truth) against Christianity/religion and using it against Leftist dogma.
I think it works very well!

[Prosthetic Conscience]

DDM, have you heard of the Oxford English Dictionary? I assumed you had, since you were the one telling people they needed to read a dictionary. But it now appears you haven't even an idea about dictionaries either. Don't worry, it was founded over 100 years ago - it's kosher for a conservative to make use of it.

[DanDaMan]

http://www.askoxford.com/concise_oed/liberal?view=uk
liberal

• adjective 1 willing to respect and accept behaviour or opinions different from one’s own. 2 (of a society, law, etc.) favourable to individual rights and freedoms. 3 (in a political context) favouring individual liberty, free trade, and moderate reform. 4 (Liberal) (in the UK) relating to the Liberal Democrat party. 5 (especially of an interpretation of a law) not strictly literal. 6 given, used, or giving in generous amounts. 7 (of education) concerned with broadening general knowledge and experience.

Number 6 is an exact portrayal of a Liberal Government in the USA.

[Philby]

2 (of a society, law, etc.) favourable to individual rights and freedoms. 3 (in a political context) favouring individual liberty, free trade, and moderate reform. 4 (Liberal) (in the UK) relating to the Liberal Democrat party.

DDM, please use these definitions while discussing politics.

[Prosthetic Conscience]

Why would you guys respond to trolling so eagerly?

Because he's bullying a new member whose first language doesn't appear to be English, and who shouldn't be put off by finding such a Neanderthal on PoFo. Krivich may be heartened to know he already understands English words better than DDM.

[kingbee]

You political zealots are fools.

I can think of an analogy involving a pot and a kettle here...

[DanDaMan]

DanDaMan's quote wrote:
2 (of a society, law, etc.) favourable to individual rights and freedoms. 3 (in a political context) favouring individual liberty, free trade, and moderate reform. 4 (Liberal) (in the UK) relating to the Liberal Democrat party.

DDM, please use these definitions while discussing politics.

I shall not use them because they are contradictory to #6 when government all over the place (liberal) is in direct opposition to 2, 3 and 4 when implemented.

I put it to you that #6 is the true meaning of LIBERAL and that if you think massive government grants 2 -4 you are embracing an irrational dogma devoid of the what history shows us to be true.

[Rei Murasame]

But Krivich actually tried to explain to you that you were using the word in an odd way.

What he was trying to tell you, was that you are calling the Obama Administration "Liberal", but in fact the most direct and and focussed term for them is "Social Democrat".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_democracy

[DanDaMan]

What he was trying to tell you, was that you are calling the Obama Administration "Liberal", but in fact the most direct and and focussed term for them is "Social Democrat".

Focused... maybe.
If you stand back, you see Obama has doubled the size of government overnight. He is a liberal government president.