Did WWI Cause 9/11? - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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By Locke II
#14154363
So:
-Treaty of Versailles led to the rise of dictators, leading to WWII
-WWII causes the Soviet occupation
-Soviet Occupation of Afghanistan leads to US intervention in Afghanistan During the cold War
-Osama Bin Laden Views them as Demons from Hell and starts Al-Qaeda
-I don't think I need to say anything from here
User avatar
By Fasces
#14154415
Yes, and the birth of Christ caused WWI.

- Development of Christianity
- Holy Roman Empire
- Austro-Hungarian Catholicism versus Balkan Orthodoxy
- Prussian/German Empire
- Austrian-German alliance under Bismark
- WWI
#14154502
I think this comments about the Jews this or that is terrible. You should do what I do and blame the Israelis. The majority of Jews aren't Israelis, and we should also factor in the fact that many Israelis aren't even Semitic anyway.
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By Travesty
#14154510
blaming Israeli's for everything doesn't work all the time though.. You can't blame the Israeli's for having your house foreclosed on. But you can blame the fucking Jews, personified by Lloyd Blankfein of Goldman Sachs and Ben Bernanke because they control the global financial system. :lol:
#14154978
Locke II wrote:-WWII causes the Soviet occupation
-Soviet Occupation of Afghanistan leads to US intervention in Afghanistan During the cold War

Your two points here don't actually follow a natural progression - occupation of Afghanistan had little or nothing to do with WWII. Needless to say it was quite some time later, and it followed the logic of the Cold War, which didn't emerge immediately after WWII either but grew out of interaction between the super powers in the late 1940s.

Locke II wrote:-Osama Bin Laden Views them as Demons from Hell and starts Al-Qaeda

Al Qaeda wasn't founded during the Afghan War, pretty sure it was put together afterwards (post Abdul Azzam if I'm remember the name correctly).

Also you logic is missing a step in this case - how did Bin Laden jump from anti-Soviet to anti-US. The answer to that one probably isn't 'Afghanistan'.
#14155017
Next thread: Did Capitalism cause 9/11
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By Varax
#14155691
At this point you're pretty much just saying that everything is interconnected - events lead to other events and if you try hard enough you can connect anything no matter how tenuous or stretched the connection becomes. Essentially it's the butterfly effect applied to history.
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By Locke II
#14156212
And at this point you are saying that everything Isn't interconnected? I believe that past events influence motives of others, and their actions become the motives for future events. This is abstract and indirect, but I believe it to be true, possibly with the exception of The Afghanistan section
By Rich
#14156265
I blame Hadrian. It was his cowardly withdrawal from Mesopotamia and Armenia that's left us in this mess. Instead of withdrawing he should have been securing the Arabian Peninsular. Trajan our past and future first citizen. We were, are and will be one pagan nation. One pagan people from Strathclyde to the Persian Gulf. From Darlington where my Father grew up to Kuwait city.
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By Varax
#14156676
Locke II wrote:And at this point you are saying that everything Isn't interconnected? I believe that past events influence motives of others, and their actions become the motives for future events. This is abstract and indirect, but I believe it to be true, possibly with the exception of The Afghanistan section.

Not at all. But as you said any connection is really abstract and indirect. As others have pointed out there are a number of other events including some far older that you could also claim to have “caused” 9/11 by the same token. So without a direct causal link at what point does saying “did WW1 cause 9/11” break down and just become a general statement about interconnectivity?
#14166099
Paradigm wrote:While I'm tempted to mock the premise in the way Fasces has done, I think we would do well to remember the degree to which the current problems in the Middle East can be traced back to the fall of the Ottoman Empire following WWI, and the European colonial rule that followed.

Nah. Problem there is Salafism. Shit has been spreading like a plague throughout the Middle-East since the mid-20th century. Shit is starting to spread to North and West Africa. Shit needs to be contained before shit hits the fan.
#14166480
Locke II wrote:So:
-Treaty of Versailles led to the rise of dictators, leading to WWII
-WWII causes the Soviet occupation
-Soviet Occupation of Afghanistan leads to US intervention in Afghanistan During the cold War
-Osama Bin Laden Views them as Demons from Hell and starts Al-Qaeda
-I don't think I need to say anything from here

I think your stretching this. Someone could do this with almost any major historical event.
By neopagan
#14167044
I believe 9/11 was the result of a combination of Muslim fanaticism, the middle-eastern tribal vendetta mentality, and the wish of a generation to find blame for the failure of there own societies. With or without WW1, these factors would be much the same.
By StanFan
#14279426
Paradigm wrote:While I'm tempted to mock the premise in the way Fasces has done, I think we would do well to remember the degree to which the current problems in the Middle East can be traced back to the fall of the Ottoman Empire following WWI, and the European colonial rule that followed.


Although I fail to see how the fall of the Ottoman Empire after World War I leads to the current state of affairs in the Middle East, European colonial rule, particularly in Palestine, coupled with the Zionist movement, does, in fact, contribute to the political affairs of the region today. Zionism was a movement founded by Theodor Herzl in the 19th century, designed to create a Jewish homeland, lost to their peoples in the uprising against Rome in 70 A.D., which dispersed the Jews throughout the world. The British offered the Jews a nation-state in Uganda, which, for obvious historical and religious reasons, was rejected. Zionism existed under the Ottoman rule, the movement was later controlled and directed by Chaim Weizmann, who was largely responsible for getting the colonial British to agree to the 1917 Balfour Declaration during World War I. Jews and Arabs coexisted in Palestine reasonably peacefully for decades, with occasional flareups because of the Zionist immigration of Jews into Palestine - which wasn't condoned or supported by the British. The Arabs did not want to be outnumbered by the Jews. Persecution of the Jews throughout history, particularly in Europe and Russia, would lead, following the Holocaust by Nazi Germany against European Jewry, to the establishment of a Jewish state, which came into existence in 1948 by the United Nations resolution. A mass exodus of Palestinians from areas which would come under the new state of Israel's political control follows, and the Arab nations fight a series of wars against Israel, unsuccessfully, in 1948, 1956, 1967 and 1973. Islam hasn't been a particularly viable military force since Charles Martel stopped its spread in Europe hundred's of years earlier. A form of Zionism, Israeli settlements in occupied territory reserved by the UN for a Palestinian state, continues to this day and creates increased tensions for Israel with its Arab neighbors.

Backed by military aid from the United States for almost 65 years, Israel is the most powerful state in the Middle East, and really has nothing to fear militarily from its Arab neighbors now, with the weakened political conditions of Iraq, Egypt and Syria. Saudi Arabia, a government very friendly to America, which controls a population very hostile to us, doesn't usually interfere in the Middle East political problems, but they do provide financial support to terrorists against Israel and America, from which Al Quida and 9/11 sprang. They have maintained normal, peaceful relations with Jordan for most of their history. Only Iran is a serious threat to Israel with a potential nuclear capability, however, Israel has over 100 nuclear weapons of its own to counter that. Interestingly, the Iranian Fundamentalist government controls one of the Middle East's population that is friendly to America........Stan.......

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