[N'Djamena]

America is not the 'life support' of Israel.

FALSE! America is the only reason Israel still exists. This is the only reason Israel can defy the UN, because they know America is behind them. Without them, Israel would be where it belongs, in the history books as a failed state.

[Dave]

No one cares about the UN.

[N'Djamena]

Bahh, whether you care about it or not, my point is that Israel is only around because of the United States and its support.

[Dave]

That's not true anymore, however. America's support may have been essential in the past, but now Israel can stand on its own.

[Oxymoron]

my point is that Israel is only around because of the United States and its support.

The US support did not help Israel in the war of independence nor in the six day war. During Yom Kippur war the Arab armies were trained and equiped by the Soviets, and the US countered. If niether side intervened the situation would be pretty much the same, IDF defeating the Arabs.

[N'Djamena]

No, the Arab armies in the 1948 war simply had the worst battle strategy ever: send in one country at a time. Fail.

And they simply didn't learn enough by the time the Six-Day War came around.

But alright. If America cut off all support to Israel now, how long do you think the Arab world would sit around and do nothing?

[Oxymoron]

I didnt know that the Caliphate was reunited. The Arabs are not a solid block with aligned interests.Many have more interest in peace with Israel then in war(Jordan,Egypt). Some countries like Arab Sunni SA view Irans Shite Persians as a larger threat then Israel. Syria is not a threat to Israel, niether is Lebanon. Iran has no way to attack Israel directly aside Rocket fire.

[N'Djamena]

The only reason those states such as Jordan and Egypt are at peace with Israel is because they are too smart to keep throwing soldiers and tanks into Israel, when it would be an impossible war for them to win due to American support. The same applies to Saudi Arabia, Oman, and Iraq. Syria and Iran hate Israel but can't do anything for the same reason, however I doubt Iran would be able to do much since as you said, they can only reach Israel by rocket and this would have to be a much more co-ordinated invasion. You can't have troops coming in getting flattened by "friendly" rockets. Also I doubt the Arabs would let Iran participate, they are Sunni, not to mention they're not even Arabs, they're Persian. As you said, they view Iran as a threat as well. I don't believe Iran would be part of the coalition but I do believe one would spring up if America were to withdraw its support.

[Oxymoron]

The only reason those states such as Jordan and Egypt are at peace with Israel is because they are too smart to keep throwing soldiers and tanks into Israel, when it would be an impossible war for them to win due to American support.

The reason is that the outcome even the most optimistic one does not warrant the risk and loss of life. Why would those states launch a war? To gain what?

Syria and Iran hate Israel but can't do anything for the same reason, however I doubt Iran would be able to do much since as you said, they can only reach Israel by rocket and this would have to be a much more co-ordinated invasion. You can't have troops coming in getting flattened by "friendly" rockets. Also I doubt the Arabs would let Iran participate, they are Sunni, not to mention they're not even Arabs, they're Persian. As you said, they view Iran as a threat as well. I don't believe Iran would be part of the coalition but I do believe one would spring up if America were to withdraw its support.

I doubt it, history and present political situations would say other wise. The Nation state has yet to show that it can overcome loyality to the clan. Furthermore these fragmented Nation states have yet to show that they can work for and share common goals. There is really no use in fighting Israel, but it is useful to use Israel to divert attention from each Nations unique situation and issues.

[Dave]

American assistance now accounts for just 1.3% of Israel's GDP. Cutting off that assistance would force some hard choices in the budget but would hardly be a disaster. The IDF is perhaps the world's skilled force and every Israeli is a soldier. Its forces are also the most technologically advanced in the region, although Saudi Arabia and the UAE do have advanced forces as well. And as we all know, Israel has nuclear weapons. Lastly, cutting off American aid does not mean cutting off American arms exports, and Israel can of course access arms technology from other advanced nations. I should also add that Israel has an advanced domestic military-industrial complex.

If I led an Arab state I would certainly be trying to figure out how to destroy Israel, but I simply don't see it happening even without American assistance.

[Falx]

Today Israel faces its greatest challenge to her survival.

Oxi you really should learn when to shut up so not to shit on the memory of the people who build the country which you love so much above the one you live in. These men fought for the survival of a nation, the current batch of cowards dropping bombs from complete safety, on both sides of the border, aren't doing anything of the sort.

[N'Djamena]

Why would those states launch a war? To gain what?

A victory for Shia Islam. A victory for the Arab world. A victory against the Zionists.

it is useful to use Israel to divert attention from each Nations unique situation and issues.

True, although Iran could become the new Israel... just not as bad. There is no need to eliminate Iran, but it could be a useful diversion.

[Sephardi]

People
Against
Caliphates

Anyways, I think I speak for all decent people, when I say that "Caliphates" and "Sultanates" should never exist again. And how are the IDF cowards? They just sent 10,000 troops against Hamas on foot!

[ThereBeDragons]

Today Israel faces its greatest challenge to her survival.

If the rate of Israeli death follows the trend it has followed for the last five years, it would take a thousand years of Palestinian attacks to destroy one percent of Israel's current population.

[Dave]

I for one would love to see the return of sultanates and caliphates on a purely emotive level. Far better to see proud islamic states than craven ones governed by Western puppets or greedy oil emirs.

[noemon]

If Israel was not the good American puppet colony that it is and the Americans played free-market on weapons, Israel could be flattened the day next. Arab dollars can buy much more sophisticated weapons than Israel's industrialized economy. And have much more man-power to handle them, than all Jews put together.

The main Arab nations that have grudges against Israel operate "world war 1" machinery, such as Egypt who even though officially on the Western block of nations politically, it still operates the F-15's.

If American support was to withdraw, and Arabs were clear to buy whatever the free-market offered them, then Israel would clearly have no chance on imposing its own terms.

And lastly dont forget that the Americans not only do not sell their weapons, to the Arabs, and send their monies to Israel, but they also exchange intelligence, boycott arms purchases by Arabs through others on the backstage and such.

I find it funny how Dave, cannot rationalize the greatness of the dependency.

[Sephardi]

I for one would love to see the return of sultanates and caliphates on a purely emotive level. Far better to see proud islamic states than craven ones governed by Western puppets or greedy oil emirs.

That's because your weird Dave

[Dave]

If Israel was not the good American puppet colony that it is and the Americans played free-market on weapons, Israel could be flattened the day next. Arab dollars can buy much more sophisticated weapons than Israel's industrialized economy. And have much more man-power to handle them, than all Jews put together.

The main Arab nations that have grudges against Israel operate "world war 1" machinery, such as Egypt who even though officially on the Western block of nations politically, it still operates the F-15's.

If American support was to withdraw, and Arabs were clear to buy whatever the free-market offered them, then Israel would clearly have no chance on imposing its own terms.

And lastly dont forget that the Americans not only do not sell their weapons, to the Arabs, and send their monies to Israel, but they also exchange intelligence, boycott arms purchases by Arabs through others on the backstage and such.

I find it funny how Dave, cannot rationalize the greatness of the dependency.

Israel has a spy satellite over the region and its forces control strategic terrain that would be necessary to attack it. Its forces are also extremely professional and competent, whereas the exact opposite is true of the Arab states. And it cannot be emphasized enough that it has nuclear weapons.

That said, if a major Arab state, particularly an oil-rich one, came under competent, skillful leadership, then I do think the Arabs could ultimately overrun Israel.

[noemon]

Israel has a spy satellite over the region and its forces control strategic terrain that would be necessary to attack it. Its forces are also extremely professional and competent, whereas the exact opposite is true of the Arab states. And it cannot be emphasized enough that it has nuclear weapons.

Listen mate, technology and nuclear weapons can only do so much against an army that has the potential of amassing a force 30 times the size of total global Jewry, even more so when that army has the potential to attain this technology if the American support to Israel is withdrawn, not just on a financial level, but on a total level. If say America decides to go free-market and start selling its technology to Arabs with no frills, ifs or buts. In a matter of months, the Arabs have the potential to get nukes, satellites, trainers, and whatever other toy is technologically available. The only thing that keeps all these Arab nations from purchasing that technology is American unconditional support to Israel.

[Dave]

You're positing a unified Arab force, Noemon. Furthermore, withdrawal of American support for Israel does not mean an unlimited willingless to proliferate the most advanced weaponry. Naturally, if both of those things occurred, then Israel would be wiped out.