[ingliz]

Causes problems today

When President Bush said he was "driven with a mission from God" and Tony Blair decides to go to war in Iraq because it is a "Christian battle", God is a problem too.

[Mujahid_X]

Problem with Islam is that its filled with violent commandments for the believers to follow in the present. Commands to "fight", "kill", "Slay" and "smite the necks" of the unbelievers "until ....religion should only be for Allah".

Who tells you these lies? Wahabi imams, islamophobes? :D

All these verses instruct muslims to perform a defensive jihad against invading infedel forces and smite their necks untill they leave, surrender or repent. Big deal. If you would read all verses, not cherry pick one, you would know this.

Example:

"Fight in the way of Allah against those who fight against you, but begin not hostilities. Lo! Allah loveth not aggressors.
And slay them wherever ye catch them, and turn them out from where they have Turned you out; for tumult and oppression are worse than killing; but fight them not at the Sacred Mosque, unless they (first) fight you there; but if they fight you, slay them. Such is the reward of those who suppress faith.
And if they cease, then indeed, Allah is Forgiving and Merciful.
And fight them on until there is no more Tumult or oppression, and there prevail justice and faith in Allah; but if they cease, Let there be no hostility except to those who practise oppression.

[Brian57]

Causes problems today

When President Bush said he was "driven with a mission from God" and Tony Blair decides to go to war in Iraq because it is a "Christian battle", God is a problem too.

Bush never said any such thing. You are quoting Palestinians.

[ingliz]

Palestinians

Americans:

“…But what if God has been holding his peace, waiting for the right man and the right nation and the right moment to act for Him and cleanse history of Evil?"

George W. Bush, January 28, 2003, State of the Union address

** America invades Iraq on March 19 **

[Brian57]

Palestinians

Americans:

“…But what if God has been holding his peace, waiting for the right man and the right nation and the right moment to act for Him and cleanse history of Evil?"

George W. Bush, January 28, 2003, State of the Union address

** America invades Iraq on March 19 **

Ill take that as your admission that the other quote was made up Palestinian BS.

[ingliz]

Palestinian BS.

Israeli BS too, it seems.

At a meeting with Palestinian leaders in Sharm el-Sheikh in June, 2003, he said that "God told me to strike at Al-Qaida, and I struck them, and then He instructed me to strike at Saddam, which I did..."

In an interview with Bob Woodward, Bush explained that the decision to invade Iraq came not from his political advisers, or even from his father, but rather from the "Father in Heaven."

*"God speaks through me... Nevertheless, I pray I be as good a messenger of his will as possible."**

George W. Bush




* Source: Mennonite Weekly
** Source: Bob Woodward Plan of Attack

[Brian57]

Palestinian BS.

Israeli BS too, it seems.

At a meeting with Palestinian leaders in Sharm el-Sheikh in June, 2003, he said that "God told me to strike at Al-Qaida, and I struck them, and then He instructed me to strike at Saddam, which I did..."

They are all quoting the same Palestinian. Mahmoud Abbas who doesnt speak English.

Problem with Islam is that its filled with violent commandments for the believers to follow in the present. Commands to "fight", "kill", "Slay" and "smite the necks" of the unbelievers "until ....religion should only be for Allah".

Who tells you these lies? Wahabi imams, islamophobes?

All these verses instruct muslims to perform a defensive jihad against invading infedel forces and smite their necks untill they leave, surrender or repent. Big deal. If you would read all verses, not cherry pick one, you would know this.

The Koran. And as we can all see, none of the verses are so limited to defensive jihad.

[3.151] We will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve, because they set up with Allah that for which He has sent down no authority, and their abode is the fire, and evil is the abode of the unjust.

[2.191] And kill them wherever you find them, and drive them out from whence they drove you out, and persecution is severer than slaughter, and do not fight with them at the Sacred Mosque until they fight with you in it, but if they do fight you, then slay them; such is the recompense of the unbelievers.(*)

[2.193] And fight with them until there is no persecution, and religion should be only for Allah...(*)

2.216] Fighting is enjoined on you, and h is an object of dislike to you; and it may be that you dislike a thing while it is good for you, and it may be that you love a thing while it is evil for you, and Allah knows, while you do not know.

[2.246] ...May it not be that you would not fight if fighting is ordained for you? They said: And what reason have we that we should not fight in the way of Allah, and we have indeed been compelled to abandon our homes and our children. But when fighting was ordained for them, they turned back, except a few of them, and Allah knows the unjust.

[3.169] And reckon not those who are killed in Allah's way as dead; nay, they are alive (and) are provided sustenance from their Lord;

[4.74] Therefore let those fight in the way of Allah, who sell this world's life for the hereafter; and whoever fights in the way of Allah, then be he slain or be he victorious, We shall grant him a mighty reward.

[4.76] Those who believe fight in the way of Allah, and those who disbelieve fight in the way of the Shaitan. Fight therefore against the friends of the Shaitan; surely the strategy of the Shaitan is weak.

[9.5] So when the sacred months have passed away, then slay the idolaters wherever you find them, and take them captives and besiege them and lie in wait for them in every ambush, then if they repent and keep up prayer and pay the poor-rate, leave their way free to them; surely Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.

[9.29] Fight those who do not believe in Allah, nor in the latter day, nor do they prohibit what Allah and His Apostle have prohibited, nor follow the religion of truth, out of those who have been given the Book, until they pay the tax in acknowledgment of superiority and they are in a state of subjection.

[9.111] Surely Allah has bought of the believers their persons and their property for this, that they shall have the garden; they fight in Allah's way, so they slay and are slain;(*)

[9.123] O you who believe! fight those of the unbelievers who are near to you and let them find in you hardness; and know that Allah is with those who guard (against evil).

[47.4] So when you meet in battle those who disbelieve, then smite the necks until when you have overcome them[/quote]

NO MORE DOUBLE POSTING. FORMAT AS ABOVE

-TIG

[ingliz]

They are all quoting the same Palestinian. Mahmoud Abbas who doesnt speak English.

Wrong! The Israeli reporter at the time read what he said were the Palestinians' minutes of the meeting. After the meeting, it is true that Mahmoud Abbas made some off the cuff remarks delivered in Arabic (translated into English by an aide) to the waiting press, but what does that matter? The "quoting" sounds much like the original Haaretz version to me.

[Brian57]

They are all quoting the same Palestinian. Mahmoud Abbas who doesnt speak English.

Wrong! The Israeli reporter at the time read what he said were the Palestinians' minutes of the meeting. After the meeting, it is true that Mahmoud Abbas made some off the cuff remarks delivered in Arabic (translated into English by an aide) to the waiting press, but what does that matter? The "quoting" sounds much like the original Haaretz version to me.

You just make this shit up as you go along.

[ingliz]

You just make this shit up as you go along.

Why would you think that?

the Israeli reporter at the time read what he said were the Palestinians' minutes of the meeting

"President Bush said to all of us: 'I'm driven with a mission from God. God would tell me, George, go and fight those terrorists in Afghanistan. And I did, and then God would tell me, George, go and end the tyranny in Iraq. . . . And I did." This sounds much like the original Haaretz version.

"God inspired me to hit al Qaeda, and so I hit it. And I had the inspiration to hit Saddam, and so I hit him."

If born again George spoke of being inspired, in context, he was referring to the 'fact' that God divinely influences people in such a way that what they do is the very Will of God. The word "inspiration" simply means "God-breathed."

"God speaks through me... a messenger of his will"

George W. Bush

[Brian57]

You just make this shit up as you go along.

Why would you think that?

Because thats what you do here.

"Moreover, this is Abbas's account in Arabic of what Bush said in English, written down by a note-taker in Arabic and then put back into English."

[ingliz]

Moreover, this is Abbas's account in Arabic of what Bush said in English, written down by a note-taker in Arabic and then put back into English.

To me, Abbas's account in Arabic of what Bush said in English, written down by a note-taker in Arabic and then put back into English sounds much like the original Haaretz version taken from the minutes of the meeting.

[Brian57]

Moreover, this is Abbas's account in Arabic of what Bush said in English, written down by a note-taker in Arabic and then put back into English.

To me, Abbas's account in Arabic of what Bush said in English, written down by a note-taker in Arabic and then put back into English sounds much like the original Haaretz version taken from the minutes of the meeting.

That's because they all originate from Abbas.

[ingliz]

That's because they all originate from Abbas.

No, the Haaretz version is found in the minutes of the meeting.

Why do you find it so difficult to believe a born again Mr. Bush said it? It is plausible, given what he said before the Iraq invasion (Congress), and after (Mr. Woodward). The Haaretz version of the quote taken from the minutes of the meeting is much of a muchness with the Washington Post version taken from the same minutes.

God inspired me to hit al Qaeda, and so I hit it. And I had the inspiration to hit Saddam, and so I hit him.

God told me to strike at Al-Qaida, and I struck them, and then He instructed me to strike at Saddam, which I did.

And not much different from Mr. Abbas's off the cuff remarks after the meeting.

I'm driven with a mission from God. God would tell me, George, go and fight those terrorists in Afghanistan. And I did, and then God would tell me, George, go and end the tyranny in Iraq. . . . And I did.

[Brian57]

That's because they all originate from Abbas.

No, the Haaretz version is found in the minutes of the meeting.

Notes on what Abbas said. Not notes of what Bush said. And all of this is irrelevant to my point. Bush isnt a biblical scholar. Even if everything Abbas said was true, I wouldnt blame Christianity for the Iraq and Afghanistan wars and would instead blame the voices Bush hears in his head.

[ingliz]

Notes on what Abbas said. Not notes of what Bush said.

.
Haha, you're such a card.

Minutes of a meeting are taken to provide a contemporaneous record of what was said and done by all parties present at the meeting.