[starman2003]

It barely survived those protests, though.

Barely survived? It was tough on them, but I don't recall any no confidence motions, or any report Bibi was contemplating resigning.

These ones will be larger, since the topic isn't as divisive as the judicial reform. Most Israelis believe Netanyahu has to go.

Netanyahu probably says the war will last a long time because as long as it does, he strays. He could drag it out, partly with a "voluntary" transfer of palestinians to Africa, and by extending the war to the west bank.

If it isn't constitutional, the corruption trials will resume in full force. A single guilty verdict would have him out as PM.

We've been waiting for that for years already.

[wat0n]

Barely survived? It was tough on them, but I don't recall any no confidence motions, or any report Bibi was contemplating resigning.

Yet Israel was becoming impossible for him to govern, and those protests were in fact polarizing. Protests to get him quit, as soon as combat's intensity goes down, will be larger.

Netanyahu probably says the war will last a long time because as long as it does, he strays. He could drag it out, partly with a "voluntary" transfer of palestinians to Africa, and by extending the war to the west bank.

Yet if he does that, the Israeli public may eventually start believing Hamas can't be toppled... Netanyahu can only go so far in extending the war.

Furthermore, when intensity diminishes (as it will) it will become more likely for Netanyahu to be forced to step down.

We've been waiting for that for years already.

And one reason for that is precisely these laws aiming to provide immunity to PMs.

[starman2003]

Yet Israel was becoming impossible for him to govern, and those protests were in fact polarizing. Protests to get him quit, as soon as combat's intensity goes down, will be larger.
Yet if he does that, the Israeli public may eventually start believing Hamas can't be toppled... Netanyahu can only go so far in extending the war.
Furthermore, when intensity diminishes (as it will) it will become more likely for Netanyahu to be forced to step down.

As I wrote, even after Hamas is essentially eliminated Bibi could extend his "antiterror" campaign to the West Bank, in order to get the Palestinians out of there too and give him more time. I just read that the idea of giving the Palestinians "the boot" is becoming normalized in Israel. What if Bibi pulls it off (or at least annihilates a lot of palestinians)? He thinks time is in his favor as the "success" he may enjoy will soon overshadow memory of the 7th. Victory, and eradicating the "terror" threat on a lasting basis may give him a new lease on life.

[wat0n]

As I wrote, even after Hamas is essentially eliminated Bibi could extend his "antiterror" campaign to the West Bank, in order to get the Palestinians out of there too and give him more time. I just read that the idea of giving the Palestinians "the boot" is becoming normalized in Israel. What if Bibi pulls it off (or at least annihilates a lot of palestinians)? He thinks time is in his favor as the "success" he may enjoy will soon overshadow memory of the 7th. Victory, and eradicating the "terror" threat on a lasting basis may give him a new lease on life.

This is extremely unlikely, even now there is no mass movement of Gazans out of the strip and there won't be. Even under these "voluntary" schemes, which countries would truly be willing to take Gazans and which countries would they be willing to move to? Congo?

[starman2003]

This is extremely unlikely, even now there is no mass movement of Gazans out of the strip and there won't be. Even under these "voluntary" schemes, which countries would truly be willing to take Gazans and which countries would they be willing to move to? Congo?

That's what they say--Congo and one or more others. I assume the countries will get some monetary or other incentive. Gaza has become and will likely remain (for months) such a hellhole great numbers of Gazans would be happy to move out. In case scarcity of food and water aren't enough to induce the bulk of them to leave, there's always Israeli bombing attacks and the perception that nowhere in Gaza is safe. In fact limiting the entry of humanitarian supplies, coupled with hitting areas where civilians were told to go, are probably intended (at least in part) to make Gazans more willing to leave.

[wat0n]

That's what they say--Congo and one or more others. I assume the countries will get some monetary or other incentive. Gaza has become and will likely remain (for months) such a hellhole great numbers of Gazans would be happy to move out. In case scarcity of food and water aren't enough to induce the bulk of them to leave, there's always Israeli bombing attacks and the perception that nowhere in Gaza is safe. In fact limiting the entry of humanitarian supplies, coupled with hitting areas where civilians were told to go, are probably intended (at least in part) to make Gazans more willing to leave.

More willing to leave how, exactly? Egypt isn't letting them into its territory, Israel isn't letting them into its territory either, there are no airports in Gaza and there are also no ships arriving into Gaza.

Congo is also a hellhole, by the way, much of it is probably still worse than Gaza.

[Pants-of-dog]

Yes, Egypt is refusing to take in refugees….

…..because they think Israel is trying to ethnically cleanse Gaza, and they refuse to be complicit.

It is dishonest to make it look like Egypt’s reluctance somehow stops Israel from trying to kill all Arabs in Palestine.

[wat0n]

Yes, Egypt is refusing to take in refugees….

…..because they think Israel is trying to ethnically cleanse Gaza, and they refuse to be complicit.

It is dishonest to make it look like Egypt’s reluctance somehow stops Israel from trying to kill all Arabs in Palestine.

Egypt is refusing to take in refugees because it sees them as a security threat.

There have been breaches of the Egypt-Gaza border before the current war and Egypt has always sent Gazans home.

[Pants-of-dog]

Egypt is refusing to take in refugees because it sees them as a security threat.

Not as far as I can tell.

Can you quote an Egyptian politician claiming this?

[wat0n]

No need - actions speak louder than words here.

[Pants-of-dog]

So the action on the part of Egypt (refusing to cooperate with Israel) speaks loudly of Israeli government plans for ethnic cleansing.

[wat0n]

So the action on the part of Egypt (refusing to cooperate with Israel) speaks loudly of Israeli government plans for ethnic cleansing.

No. The actions of Egypt refusing to take Gazans in even before this war are what speaks louder than words.

[Pants-of-dog]

Lol.

"Ignore what Egypt is doing now!

Look at what it did a few months ago to see what Egypt thinks of what Israel is doing now!"

I am often amused when arguments require time travel.

[wat0n]

Lol.

"Ignore what Egypt is doing now!

Look at what it did a few months ago to see what Egypt thinks of what Israel is doing now!"

I am often amused when arguments require time travel.

You do realize both can be true, do you?

Egypt doesn't accept them now, and it didn't accept them earlier.

And this is a years-long policy, back in 2008 there was a breach of the Egypt-Gaza border where 200,000-700,000 Gazans crossed into Egypt, and they were sent back (voluntarily or not). This was under Mubarak, Al Sisi has a harsher policy to the point of actively looking for and destroying the tunnels between Gaza and Egypt.

[Pants-of-dog]

Yes, Egypt has had different reasons for trying to stop Gazan refugees from coming to Egypt.

The current reason is to help prevent a successful conclusion to the ongoing ethnic cleansing by the IDF.

[wat0n]

Have you ever considered that those different reasons are still valid today?

[Pants-of-dog]

Yes, and since these other reasons do not contradict the claim that Egypt refuses to be complicit in ethnic cleansing, the claim is still consistent with what we observe.

[wat0n]

Yes, and since these other reasons do not contradict the claim that Egypt refuses to be complicit in ethnic cleansing, the claim is still consistent with what we observe.

Yet Egypt's behavior and motivations would also be consistent with Israel not being engaged in ethnic cleansing in Gaza, so that doesn't really prove anything.

As I said, there's no way for Gazans to leave en masse, and Israel doesn't seem to be interested in making that possible either.

[Pants-of-dog]

Yet Egypt's behavior and motivations would also be consistent with Israel not being engaged in ethnic cleansing in Gaza, so that doesn't really prove anything.

Yes, exactly. You have now understood why your argument about Egyptian politics is pointless.

We do know that Egyptian President Abdel Fattah el-Sissi said the current war is “an attempt to push the civilian inhabitants to ... migrate to Egypt.”

As I said, there's no way for Gazans to leave en masse, and Israel doesn't seem to be interested in making that possible either.

There is at least one policy paper put out by think tanks in Israel showing that exact interest. As well as the comments made by several Israeli politicians.

[wat0n]

Yes, exactly. You have now understood why your argument about Egyptian politics is pointless.

We do know that Egyptian President Abdel Fattah el-Sissi said the current war is “an attempt to push the civilian inhabitants to ... migrate to Egypt.”

Interesting, why don't you quote the whole thing?

Their refusal is rooted in fear that Israel wants to force a permanent expulsion of Palestinians into their countries and nullify Palestinian demands for statehood. El-Sissi also said a mass exodus would risk bringing militants into Egypt’s Sinai Peninsula, from where they might launch attacks on Israel, endangering the two countries’ 40-year-old peace treaty.

There is at least one policy paper put out by think tanks in Israel showing that exact interest. As well as the comments made by several Israeli politicians.

And there are comments by other Israeli politicians saying otherwise

Where are the concrete means of leaving Gaza en masse? Since land and air aren't options, where are the ships arriving to Gaza to pick Gazans up?