[Waltanheri]

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite? ... 6443786047

Nice solution, just first of all we should decide which Palestine we want (Gaza with Hamas or WB with Fatah). Or perhaps we will have two palestinian states?

[Sephardi]

He's gonna get shot in the face by another Baruch Goldstein or by another Samir Cunt-ar (Kuntar).

[Captain Sam]

Nice solution, just first of all we should decide which Palestine we want (Gaza with Hamas or WB with Fatah). Or perhaps we will have two palestinian states?

Hamas doesn't seek a Palestinian state, and it won't give up Gaza without a fight. The UN would have to go into Gaza and clear out Hamas before anything can be done with that region. But that won't ever happen, because the UN is useless.

The PLO has legitimate aspirations though, and does seek to establish a Palestinian state. Israel should be forced to take out the settlements out of the West Bank or face heavy sanctions.

[Gitana]

Israel back to the original border, two-mile wide walled no-mans zone between the two, patrolled by peacekeepers, help Palestine rebuild. No violation of Palestine airspace by Israel without permission.

Zero tolerance for aggressions.

Done.

[Oxymoron]

patrolled by peacekeepers

Or as they are called widely in the Middle East walking targets.

[Gitana]

Mines.

Aggressions would die out if Palestine had it's original borders back and was getting help to rebuild, and neither side was forced to recognize the other. Israel would be the far bigger problem, I guarantee it.

[Captain Sam]

Aggressions would die out if Palestine had it's original borders back

Palestine doesn't exist, nor has it ever existed.

and neither side was forced to recognize the other.

Well the only way Palestine could exist, is if Israel gives it independence. So obviously Israel would be forced to recognize it, and if Israel gives it independence, obviously Palestine would be forced to recognize Israel.

[Oxymoron]

Aggressions would die out if Palestine had it's original borders back

The UN mandated one would mean being part of Jordan and Egypt I doubt any side wants? or the pre 1967 one?

and was getting help to rebuild, and neither side was forced to recognize the other.

Formula for success

Israel would be the far bigger problem, I guarantee it.

I feel otherwise.

[Gitana]

Well the only way Palestine could exist, is if Israel gives it independence.

The Palestinians don't need Israel to grant them anything to exist. They already do, they identify as Palestinians, and have for a long time. They just need Israel to butt out and stay within their own borders. What Palestine does need is international recognition.

[Oxymoron]

The Palestinians don't need Israel to grant them anything to exist. They already do, they identify as Palestinians, and have for a long time. They just need Israel to butt out and stay within their own borders. What Palestine does need is international recognition.

Right because suicide bombings and Rocket attacks is staying in your own borders. Stop making the Palestinians some abused puppies, both sides are equally to blame for the conflict.

[Gitana]

Which is why I said:

Israel back to the original border, two-mile wide walled no-mans zone between the two, patrolled by peacekeepers, help Palestine rebuild. No violation of Palestine airspace by Israel without permission.

Zero tolerance for aggressions.

But let's not pretend that there is equal blame, either. There was a beginning to this - and there needs to be an end.

Worst political decision in human history.

[Oxymoron]

But let's not pretend that there is equal blame, either. There was a beginning to this - and there needs to be an end.

Yeah and it began when Romans forced the Jews out of their land, and it recently began when the Muslim would not accept the reestablished Jewish state in their Caliphate and invaded Israel with a united Arab army.

Worst political decision in human history.

Yeah much worse then Versaille,

[Gitana]

The the Romans should have been responsible for reparations, no?


Would you give Israel to the Christians if they ever decided they wanted it?

What other political movement has ever been able to take a country, in modern times, because of some 2,000 year old claim to it - that two other religions also share in?

[Oxymoron]

The the Romans should have been responsible for reparations, no?

Reparations? No Jews wanted their land back. Just like when the Persians returned Jews to their land after they were forced out by the Assyrians.

Would you give Israel to the Christians if they ever decided they wanted it?

Why? Also Jews are not nessacarily a religion, most Zionists do not follow Judaism. You realise Jews are an ethinic group aside being a religion.

- that two other religions also share in?

A very ignorant statement, the religion doesnt claim anything the Jewish people do.

What other political movement has ever been able to take a country, in modern times, because of some 2,000 year old claim to it

1. Iran
2. Egypt
Just 2 from top of my head.

Also Ukraine,BeloRussia,Georgia,Armenia,Arzebajan

[danholo]

This is retarded. Why is this even taken seriously?

[Gitana]

Why? Also Jews are not nessacarily a religion, most Zionists do not follow Judaism. You realise Jews are an ethinic group aside being a religion.

Judaism has distinct ethnic groups within itself, but that does not make the entire group a single ethnicity. Ashkenazic (German or Eastern European), Sephardic (Spain and Portugal), Mizrahim (Middle Eastern, North African) and smaller subgroups exist.
http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20090304220051AANEwK2

That being said - then what exactly is the single group identifier for the Jewish people, if not religion, race or a single ethnicity?

1. Iran
2. Egypt
Just 2 from top of my head.
Also Ukraine,BeloRussia,Georgia,Armenia,Arzebajan

I wasn't aware that these countries were reclaimed by thousands and thousands of people who came from all over the world to create a new country from ancient history.

This is retarded. Why is this even taken seriously?

Obviously not all of us have a complete understanding of this issue. Why does that make it retarded to discuss it?

[Oxymoron]

That being said - then what exactly is the single group identifier for the Jewish people, if not religion, race or a single ethnicity?

All Jewish Ethinic groups are closely related, plus we share common traditions and heritage.

I wasn't aware that these countries were reclaimed by thousands and thousands of people who came from all over the world to create a new country from ancient history.

Keep moving the goal line that is a very effective debate tactic used on the internet, good job.

Come on please try to keep some integrity, nothing personal but think before posting ; that way you wont be pushed into a corner you yourself created.

[Sephardi]

The Palestinians don't agree with this plan of Solana:

Sammy Smooha of Haifa University, who published the Index of Arab-Jewish Relations in Israel in 2004, did ask them, and they answered with a resounding No. Despite all the rhetoric about being Palestinians first, hardly a single Israeli Arab would trade Israeli citizenship for a Palestinian one.

Simply raising the idea scares Israeli Arabs. In his Index,Smooha found that 81 percent of the Arabs were afraid of a serious assault on their civil rights. The majority (63.6 percent) also feared a transfer of Arab citizens or annexation of Arab villages to the Palestinian state against their wishes.

Oops.

[Gitana]

All Jewish Ethinic groups are closely related, plus we share common traditions and heritage.

It was my understanding that there many different traditions, languages, etc amongst the worlds population of Jewish people, and indeed conflict amongst Jews themselves as to who is more or less Jewish. Since one is either Jewish through matrilineal descent or by conversion, it just seems to me that one could similarily claim that all Catholics, for example, are a group somewhat like the Jews. No?

I wasn't aware that these countries were reclaimed by thousands and thousands of people who came from all over the world to create a new country from ancient history.

Keep moving the goal line that is a very effective debate tactic used on the internet, good job.

Come on please try to keep some integrity, nothing personal but think before posting ; that way you wont be pushed into a corner you yourself created.

I wasn't trying to be difficult; that is exactly what comes to mind when I think of how Israel was established. Where Israel sits today, weren't there Jews, Arabs, Muslims, etc all sharing that area before Israel was founded?

I am not terribly well-informed on this subject; but I am also not afraid to ask questions.

[Tailz]

In reply to the UN, how would UN action be implemented, Israel (also via the American veto) has been more than willing to ignore UN action - this would be no different - especialy with Israeli controled offensive systems patroling Palestines borders, air, and seaways. It would be hollow action until the UN could enforce it, which would have to be a confrontation with Israeli non-compliance.

Where Israel sits today, weren't there Jews, Arabs, Muslims, etc all sharing that area before Israel was founded?

Yes. But with the introduction of Zionist sepratism for the Jewish portion of the population, and the rise of Arab nationalism - the idea of living together went out the window.