[Gnote]

I am coming to that conclusion myself.

Theoretically speaking, why would you be opposed to a neutered government that you disagree with? Surely it would be better for them to be passing fluff legislation, than legislation designed to nationalize all industry?

If they won't table bills that are more than fluff, then they essentially can't DO anything.

[ingliz]

The "bill" is usually related to something contained within the elected party's electoral manifesto but this is traditionally interpreted fairly loosely.

[Gnote]

In *real* countries that use this sort of system, the bill is generally a budget. But given the fictitious nature of our sim, I think a comprehensive budget would be difficult.

[ingliz]

"In summary the precedents and conventions suggest that the confidence of Parliament in the Government of the day can be assumed to exist, even in periods of minority government, unless and until it is shown to be otherwise, and that can only be demonstrated conclusively and unambiguously by way of a confidence vote. A Government is entitled to assume the confidence of Parliament even if it is faced with defeats or significant rebellions in the division lobbies. The Government may decide to put Parliament’s confidence to the test by moving a motion of confidence or by expressly treating a motion put down by itself or by others as a confidence motion, or it can refuse to do this and put the onus on its opponents to provoke such a test by moving a no-confidence motion."

Erskine May is not much help, anything can trigger a confidence vote in the UK Parliament.

[Dr House]

In *real* countries that use this sort of system, the bill is generally a budget. But given the fictitious nature of our sim, I think a comprehensive budget would be difficult.

I don't think a budget would be all that difficult, actually. We already have most of the facts regarding what our fictitious government looks like.

I like the idea of having a budget be the initial legislation.

[ingliz]

We already have most of the facts

But we don't - We would have to know what's the present health system, how large are the armed forces, the prison system, how law and order are organised, the school system, the average wage by decile etc etc - a budget is out of the question for now.

[Dr House]

So, should the GM council hash out the details on what the country looks like and shit? If I'm not mistaken, that's what it was originally intended for.

[ingliz]

You see if the communists were really sneaky and a budget was required then we could implement most of our programme by just budgeting for a universal healthcare system etc and pretending that it was already in place before we came to power and then what would you do when you took over, abolish everything. I don't think that would endear you to the electorate, closing hospitals and schools usually costs votes.

[Dr House]

Why would the PNL close down public hospitals and schools?

[Oxymoron]

Because we would put state of the art new Schools and Hospitals in their places.

[ingliz]

Why would the PNL close down public hospitals and schools?

Because if you voted down the budget there would be no money to pay the staff's wages, buy medical supplies, pay outside services, utilities etc.

[Dr House]

if we voted down the budget your party would not be the government. We could subsequently propose the same budget allocation to healthcare or whatever as you did in our own confidence motion.

[ingliz]

But if you do that why vote down the budget in the first place?

[Dr House]

because I'm not voting down the budget. I'm voting down your government.

[Demosthenes]

So, should the GM council hash out the details on what the country looks like and shit? If I'm not mistaken, that's what it was originally intended for.

Are you volunteering? Dave had said he was going to be able to do that, but nothing materialize?

Honi's rules shall stand as my own in this thread and the other.

[Dr House]

Yeah I can do that.

Should I hammer out the details and present them in the GM council thread?

[Demosthenes]

If you're willing go right ahead, just make sure to be fair in the history to all sides in one way or another. If you take liberties with something that would aid one cause make sure to give them somewhere else to aid another.

[Dr House]

Well the history and economic structire is pretty much already written in the broad strokes. I'm just filling in the nitty-gritty details, which the government will need for proper policymaking.

[Demosthenes]

That'll do, just make it official looking so I can copy the code and place it in the sticky, be sure to include the current parties (anything you want on the PUC, if anything), and whatever else seems relevant.