Glen wrote:Can you expand on what is meant by superior?
All people have a feeling of superiority. To a degree that is natural, until it isn't natural anymore. However, that feeling is different in each nation, it's also expressed differently. What differentiates the British is the experience of the empire and of having virtually been the masters of the world for centuries. That did not lead to a
shallow ideology of the
superhuman, as with the Nazis, but it endowed the British with an unshakable and
deep believe in their own superiority. The empire is gone, yet its aftereffects are still felt.
layman wrote:Maybe in private but I have literally never heard you be critical of Germans on POFO.
Frollein would disagree. If you look at my posting record, you also find that I blasted German nationalists, posted about Nazi prosecution and the Herero genocide, racist murders in Germany, etc.
If I don't attack Germany's refugee policy or European policy, it is because I agree with it.
There was a poll of Europeans a while back to ask who they thought was the most arrogant country in Europe. The Germans said the French and the French said the Germans. I don’t remember about the british.
What has that got to do with anything? These polls are useless anyways. All nations have perceptions of other nations that are very far removed from the facts. For example, the British live in their Anglophone bubble and are completely ignorant about Germany.
I don’t think I fly of the handle do I?
No, but you don't always take critical remarks well.
The reason I am doubtful is that we were much behind the continent in the 1970’s in terms of wealth and so logically I think we would be more sensitive to criticism back then.
I'm not talking about GDP, but about how people relate to their national identity. That is not based on objective facts. In the 60s and 70s, the empire was still alive in people's consciousness. To mentally resuscitate the empire and to make it the ground for a glorious future, as some of the Brexiteers do, is far less credible today.
Nations tend to be more sensitive when they have inferiority issues.
Absolutely, and that tells me that the British today feel that their relative prosperity is not based on solid grounds, which does explain anti-immigration sentiments.
Our economy was a basket case in the 1970’s.
Your economy was in a transition, which involved some hardship before reaching a new normal.
I don't pretend to know your country better than you do, as you seem to infer from what I have said previously, but you have to admit that looking at your country from different perspectives, from the outside and inside, over an extended period of time, gives a person another point of view, that may be novel to you, but must not necessarily be wrong. In every country I have lived in, the immigrant community will always reflect on the oddities of its host country noticing many things the natives don't. There is no absolute truth, just a continuous triangulation of different viewpoints that lead us in the quest for the unknown.
Kaiserschmarrn wrote:Overall, there doesn't really seem to be too much difference in attitudes towards immigration between Germany and Britain, although Germans are more positive about migration from other EU countries than Brits. However, it's certainly not true that "nobody in Germany would think anything about it", whether it's migration from Poland or other EU countries.
That "nobody" is obviously a figure of speech not meant literally. Obviously I know Germans ranting about foreigners at the
Stammtisch, obviously there is endless ranting about "Polish thieves" from one end of Germany to the other, yet it has not led to anti-immigration sentiments translating into political decisions as in the UK. In addition to a large amount of EU immigration, Germany was able to absorb more than a million refugees in a single year. I know you hope for a political backlash, but I think you'll be disappointed. Germany has absorbed enormous amounts of migrants all along its history and is genetically one of the most divers countries in Europe. The Huguenots were welcomed by the Prussians just like the Polish migrant workers in the 19th century found a new home in the Ruhr region. I grew up in a small village in the 50s, certainly not renowned for its open-mindedness, with a Pole in my own family. He had a funny name nobody could pronounce, but he married into my family and nobody in that village would have though of him as anyone but one of their own. He was hardworking, and that was all there was to it. All through my school days, I shared classes with kids from foreign countries, mostly Eastern Europeans, and we always accepted them like we would accepted Germans from other towns.
I believe you do romanticise Germany in that respect, while you freely show contempt towards other EU countries.
I have pointed to the fact that current German mainstream politicians don't exploit xenophobic sentiments for political reasons as is happening in the UK. What is misconstrued as Merkel's invitation, is in fact a clear message to a domestic audience that attacks on refugees will not be tolerated. That,
and only that, is the meaning of "refugees are welcome". The message sent out even by mainstream politicians in the UK is that "immigrants are a problem." To point to that difference has nothing to do with "romanticizing." Racism is not a god-given. Attitudes towards foreigners are shaped by politicians. Germany and the UK are two examples how politicians shape that public awareness towards foreigners.
All through history different ethnic groups have lived peacefully side by side for centuries until something happens that makes them kill each other. The reason for killing each other is not the presence of the other group, as is claimed by the racist, but a political event that triggers xenophobic sentiments. It is our choice, we don't have to destroy our society with racist prejudices and politicians have a duty to oppose xenophobia, and not to fan it, in order to strengthen the social fabric.
- By grassroots1
- By Verv