- 01 Jul 2013 09:45
#14264506
Punishment (in the sense of forced restitution) cannot exceed the cost to the victim, plus reasonable enforcement costs.
Nothing else would be just. In particular, punishing somebody more severely than the damage they caused simply because others are also engaged in similar crimes is a gross violation of justice.
I think you hit the nail on the head. First, it is clearly unjust to cage somebody for 7 years for the mere crime of groping. That many others engage in groping, and that the crime is under-reported and under-enforcement are ethically irrelevant to the injustice.
However, by privatising currently-public areas such as public transportation and streets, owners of such facilities may condition entrance on a commitment not to grope, with groping leading to (temporary or permanent) expulsion / eviction.
That way (in generally in answering your first question), two goals are achieved without injustice. First, those frequenting such previously-public facilities can be secure in the groping-free nature of such use. Since most people prefer to be free from groping, profit-oriented operators are likely to impose such anti-groping rules (assuming the problem manifests itself).
Second, a deterrence would be created against groping, even if the formal "punishment" (i.e. restitution) is fairly moderate.
Thus while the formal, enforced "punishment" is always monetary and can never exceed the actual damages (plus reasonable costs), the full implication of the crime in terms of society's reaction may well be much harsher, albeit expressed in terms of people's legitimate preference not to associate with the criminal, rather than through the imposition of force on the criminal.
Did you say the punishment cannot exceed the crime?
What if the rate of reporting, investigating and/ or conviction is very low?
Criminals might find the risk-reward ratio attractive.
Punishment (in the sense of forced restitution) cannot exceed the cost to the victim, plus reasonable enforcement costs.
Nothing else would be just. In particular, punishing somebody more severely than the damage they caused simply because others are also engaged in similar crimes is a gross violation of justice.
Japan has a maximum sentence of 7 years for groping. This isn't because victims suffer intense emotional harm but because the crime is massively under reported and the state wishes to use the potential of a lengthy sentence as a deterrent. If suspected gropers were banned from public transport and other crowded places they may be more cautious.
What do you think?
I think you hit the nail on the head. First, it is clearly unjust to cage somebody for 7 years for the mere crime of groping. That many others engage in groping, and that the crime is under-reported and under-enforcement are ethically irrelevant to the injustice.
However, by privatising currently-public areas such as public transportation and streets, owners of such facilities may condition entrance on a commitment not to grope, with groping leading to (temporary or permanent) expulsion / eviction.
That way (in generally in answering your first question), two goals are achieved without injustice. First, those frequenting such previously-public facilities can be secure in the groping-free nature of such use. Since most people prefer to be free from groping, profit-oriented operators are likely to impose such anti-groping rules (assuming the problem manifests itself).
Second, a deterrence would be created against groping, even if the formal "punishment" (i.e. restitution) is fairly moderate.
Thus while the formal, enforced "punishment" is always monetary and can never exceed the actual damages (plus reasonable costs), the full implication of the crime in terms of society's reaction may well be much harsher, albeit expressed in terms of people's legitimate preference not to associate with the criminal, rather than through the imposition of force on the criminal.
Free men are not equal and equal men are not free.
Government is not the solution. Government is the problem.
Government is not the solution. Government is the problem.